Created attachment 25253 [details] [review]
xkeyboard-config.ru.phonetic.diff

Generally, I agree. I just will ask some Russian users of that layout...

Plz, don't do it. As example, in Russian we spell 'X' as 'Kha' and not as lat. 'X'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A5

If you change it, than you can't name it 'phonetic' any more. 

So you mean parts of my patch or in complete are bogus? And the layout in Wikipedia is bogus as well?

The first (LatX) and second (LatH) changes have nothing common with phonetic transcription. And the third one cannot be done alone. 

Russian spell Lat 'H' and Rus 'Kha' nearly equally. 

If you have in mind that layout in Wikipedia:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d9/Keyboard_layout_ru_fonetic.png/400px-Keyboard_layout_ru_fonetic.png

IMHO, it is not correct. It cannot be named 'phonetic'

(In reply to comment #5)
> The first (LatX) and second (LatH) changes have nothing common with phonetic
> transcription. And the third one cannot be done alone. 
> 
> Russian spell Lat 'H' and Rus 'Kha' nearly equally. 
> 
> If you have in mind that layout in Wikipedia:
> 
> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d9/Keyboard_layout_ru_fonetic.png/400px-Keyboard_layout_ru_fonetic.png

I had 

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Keyboard_layout_ru_fonetic.png

in mind, but I think they are the same.

> IMHO, it is not correct. It cannot be named 'phonetic'

Ok. So one should fix the keyboard layout in Wikipedia first.

It seems MSWin and MacOSX consider phonetic the way Stefan proposes. But in reality (keeping Russian phonetics in mind) Evgeny is right...

What about keeping 'phonetic' the way it is - and adding 'win_phonetic' with Stefan's changes?

Well, I'm afraid that nobody really cares about reality, just about the "standard" that is used by MSWin/MacOSX, which is what the user would expect to get when selecting "ru(phonetic)". What about adjusting "phonetic" according to the MSWin/MacOSX "standard" and introduce a "phonetic_real"? Just an idea.

> Well, I'm afraid that nobody really cares about reality
Well, if not reality, what about traditions, prehistory, compatibility? That "real phonetic" variant was there (in xk-c) for quite a while. According to http://www.linux.org.ru/view-message.jsp?msgid=2494578 some people (even it is a minority) are using it.

> get when selecting "ru(phonetic)". What about adjusting "phonetic" according to
> the MSWin/MacOSX "standard" and introduce a "phonetic_real"? Just an idea.
Breaking compatibility is the last thing I would like to do, even if few are affected. At least not without a serios reason, which I frankly do not see here...

The variant name (in GUI) "Windows phonetic" IMHO would crearly indicate: "If you came from MSWin and would like to use phonetic - try me!"

I don't have a strong opinion here, so if you think this is the right approach, please go ahead. :-)

realistically, the set of people using it and relying on it now are the sorts of people who will know what this is and how to change it.  the sorts of people coming from windows/mac and just expecting it to work won't go to the effort to find out, and i suspect they're the vast majority.  how about marking ru(phonetic) as the 'real' variant or whatever, and ru(phoneticwin) as the default in the descriptions, so existing users aren't affected, but new users get what they expect?

Yes. Daniel, I think meanwhile we all agree with that. :-)

Daniel,

The real _default_ variant for 'ru' is 'winkeys'. That's where majority belongs, switchers or not. In order to pick either of the phonetic variants , users (switchers or not) have to check the available non-default variants, anyway. And seeing there 2 variants 'phonetic' and 'win_phonetic' (with proper descriptions), they will be able to make a guess, I am sure.

Added ru(phonetic_winkeys). Please try from git.